Abstract
A transcript of an interview with Beth S. Lyons by Leigh Swigart and David P. Briand. The interview took place on February 19, 2015 in West New York, NJ, USA, and the transcript, which is represented here, has been reviewed and edited from the original audio version. During the interview, Lyons reminisces on the transition from Legal Aid in New York to ICTR; volunteer work for the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa; experiences in Pyongyang for fiftieth anniversary end of Korean War tribunal; work with New York law firm Stevens, Hinds, & White; decision to first apply as list counsel for ICTR and ICTY and application process; visit to prisons to interview witnesses; arrival in Arusha for the first time; financial costs of being defense counsel at ICTR; culture shock and differences between South Africa and Tanzania, and different pay rates for local and international UN workers in Arusha; winning the Nzuwonemeye appeal. Lyons also discusses work with IADL; importance of independent defense counsel in legitimizing international tribunals; attempt to exclude Alison Des Forges as expert witness in the Simba case and use of her book by prosecutors; witness intimidation in Rwandan prison and in the Simba case; witness preparation and tampering to push official narrative; lack of convictions on conspiracy to commit genocide in Rwanda; importance of good translation and accurate transcripts; difference between charges of genocide and conspiracy to commit genocide; definition of command responsibility; plea bargaining at ICTY and ICTR; presumption of guilt and what happens when a defendant is acquitted by an international tribunal; problems associated wit UN pay differential at ICTR; experiences defending the Military II case; comparison between Legal Aid work and work at ICTR; appeal of Nzuwonemeye trial judgment; reasons for delay in ad hoc tribunals, and influence of Nuremburg model on ICTR operation and need for proof beyond reasonable doubt to give international tribunals legitimacy.